March 24, 2022
Cindy Lopez:
Welcome. My name is Cindy Lopez, the host of this CHC podcast, Voices of Compassion. We hope you find a little courage, feel connected and experience compassion every time you listen.
Today’s episode we’re talking about the brain of a teen. Our brains develop over time, and the adolescent brain is still developing and changing. So, how does that impact their behavior and decision-making? Some parents of teens feel out of touch with their kids because peers become more important, and parents wonder how they can still be relevant. The reality is that your teen is changing, but you as parents still matter. The values you’ve instilled in your children are still a part of who they are. So listen to today’s episode as we talk with Dr. Erin Hoolihan, licensed psychologist at CHC. She will share her expertise and advice for parents of teens from brain development to teen behavior.
Welcome Dr. Hoolihan.
Erin Hoolihan, PsyD:
Thank you so much for having me. I am very passionate about working with adolescents, especially older adolescents and young adults, and with that comes working a lot with parents. So I’m really excited to talk about brain development and adolescence and how parents can be helpful to their teens.
Cindy Lopez:
Thank you, Dr. Hoolihan. We’re so grateful that you’re here with us today and sharing your expertise with us. I am personally fascinated by the brain and how it works. Let’s talk brain development. Can you give us a brief picture of how the brain develops?
Erin Hoolihan, PsyD:
So simply put the brain develops from the back to the front. So in the back we have the parts of our brain that help with coordination and motor movement, processing sensory information. So we can think about babies and infants and toddlers about when this is developing for them, learning how to walk, learning how to use different parts of their body and then as we move to the front of the brain, this is where we’re dealing with some of those higher level skills, and importantly, the prefrontal cortex, which is right at the front of our brain is the last to develop, and this part of our brain is not fully developed until our mid twenties. So the prefrontal cortex is important for impulse control, emotional control, planning, organization, finishing tasks.
Cindy Lopez:
And for our listeners out there, when you think prefrontal cortex, you can also think executive functioning.
Erin Hoolihan, PsyD:
Exactly.
Cindy Lopez:
And one day as a parent, you might be seeing your teen like they’re so together and thinking through things and then the next day it’s like what happened, that’s totally gone and it’s all a process, and it’s all a process of each person’s development. So as a parent you may notice that sometimes your teen makes sound decisions and shows some maturity and other times their decisions seem really impulsive and emotional. So, Dr. Hoolihan, why is that happening from a brain development perspective?
Erin Hoolihan, PsyD:
So the short answer to this is that the prefrontal cortex is still developing. So it means that those skills around impulse control, managing emotions, planning and organizing these skills are still developing, and a side effect of this is that teens may sometimes be able to really effectively use these skills, and at other times may not seem quite as skillful, and from a developmental or brain development perspective, adolescence is a time of learning and of trial and error. So they’re dealing with more intense feelings, more intense impulses, challenging academic and interpersonal situations that many of them have not dealt with up until this point in their lives. And they’re doing it with a brain that’s still developing, and I say this because I think it is important to give some context to like you said Cindy, about why maybe sometimes decisions seem really mature and sometimes they seem impulsive or emotional, and I also say this to be mindful about supporting youth during this developmental phase.
So it’s really important for teenagers to go into the world and to try new things, but then also to have safe adults to come back to who a) they can talk about these trials, and these successes and these failures with, but also to have an adult who can model good behavior for them, and if I can I’d like to make a quick point about that modeling the good behavior because I think this is really important for parents. So when we’re dealing with teenagers, they’re at this unique point where they’re dealing with more challenging situations with this limited toolkit. So they’re often going to be referencing the adults in their lives for how to act in these tough situations, but at the same time they’re developing these critical thinking and these analytical skills – they’re also in our prefrontal cortex, and maybe able to question some inconsistencies that they might be seeing in the adults in their lives. Um, So I always like to tell parents, and again, adults broadly who work with teenagers that saying the right thing is important during this time, but doing the right thing is as important, if not more important.
Cindy Lopez:
Modeling is really effective, but we kind of forget that I think as our kids grow up and we kind of expect them to know, but understanding that their brain is developing in this way where the prefrontal cortex is not yet fully developed, and as those who work with teenagers, I think that allows some grace, like you know it allows those adults, those parents to give their teens a little grace, and to give them some leeway, as you just mentioned, like give them some opportunity to do the trial and error in a safe way.
Erin Hoolihan, PsyD:
Yeah. Yeah, no, thank you for saying that I think we talk a lot about this modeling for like toddlers, right or small children, and we don’t talk about it quite as much when we’re dealing with teenagers. And I think anger is a really good example of this. I’ve worked with families who will say, we tell our teenager that when you get angry, you know, you take a deep breath, you walk away, you count to 10, all those really good skills that we should be using if we’re getting angry, but then the teenager goes home and sees their parents yelling and screaming or throwing things when they get angry, and I think the important part there is that they can see that inconsistency, and they’re thinking critically enough about their own experiences and what they’re seeing in the world to sort of say like, hey, this doesn’t, line up for me. You know, I’m not seeing you doing what you’re telling me to do, and that inconsistency can be hard to sit with as a teenager or a parent.
Cindy Lopez:
Also that kind of inconsistency, if a teenager’s noticing it, that could create some conflict in the relationship between the parent and teen, and so that is one thing to keep in mind as a parent as well, and if you’re the parent, right, the teen is doing their work, the teen is doing their developmentally appropriate work, and so just recognizing that as a parent I think is half the battle.
Erin Hoolihan, PsyD:
Definitely. Like you said, I liked that part about giving grace to teenagers, but it can be hard when they’re doing things that seem impulsive or, you know, emotionally driven, but remembering that they are encountering these really challenging situations with not a full toolkit, right? Not a fully developed brain, which should be hard.
Mike:
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Cindy Lopez:
So I’ve read that the teen years are a period of time when the brain is remodeling and they talk about this as pruning; so as adolescents start to find their passion and the things that they like and enjoy can you comment on that?
Erin Hoolihan, PsyD:
So this synaptic pruning is a scientific term that you’re referring to, but basically it’s this principle of use it or lose it that our brain engages in starting in early childhood. So what this means is on the one hand their brain is getting rid of information that’s not actively being used, but on the other side of that process the brain is making more room for information and skills that are being used and being developed during this time.
So this process of pruning allows the brain to be more effective as it focuses the brain’s energy only on what the youth is needing and using at that time.
Cindy Lopez:
So Dr. Hoolihan, as you’re talking and this idea of remodeling the brain keeps coming back to mind, and I’m wondering what that looks like.
Erin Hoolihan, PsyD:
So, I like to think of it more as further development or further expanding or specialization, then maybe a remodeling because the teenage brain is just continuing to develop as it has since the individual was an infant. So we want to encourage these new experiences during this time to give the teenagers’ brains the opportunity to learn, during this time of growth and to find a new passion while continuing to support them through this.
So, the reality is that for teenagers their horizons are expanding. They’re trying new things, but they don’t have the full toolkit, and we need to provide them support from reliable and safe adults for them to be able to come back and talk about what the experiences were like when they went out and tried these new things or help them problem solve new situations that they’ve never experienced before.
I like to use a driving metaphor when talking about this development, and this finding new passions, that we allow teenagers to drive, right? That we’ve decided that, you know, 15, 16 is an appropriate age to start learning how to drive, but hopefully no one’s just throwing a 15 year old the keys and telling them to hop on 101, right? On a state level, limits when you can get your driver’s permit, how long you have to wait between getting your license and getting your permit, who can be in the car. There’s all these laws that regulate how teenagers can drive and then families usually teach driving in a gradual process, right? So it may be starting in a parking lot and then moving to a residential area with a slower speed limit and then up to the city roads and then onto the freeway. And I think that driving is a really good example of a lot of things that teenagers will encounter in life. It’s a big responsibility, and it’s a big milestone, and if they’re taught and supported in learning how to drive safely by the adults in their lives it’s a privilege – it can offer great autonomy and freedom. If they’re not, it’s something that can be quite dangerous, and I think that that is a good example if you’re thinking about, like, during this time of finding new passions, we want to encourage going into the world and trying new things, and I want to encourage parents to continue to like be supportive and a safe place for their kids to return to, as they’re trying to navigate the scary world out there.
Cindy Lopez:
Yeah and it’s interesting, like this concept of neuroplasticity, we’ve probably heard that term a lot over the past few years, but this concept that you can change your brain. And so encouraging your kids to try new things, as you mentioned, Dr. Hoolihan, like join a new club, try out for the play you know, things you haven’t done before. And then the brain responds to that new experience and that activity, that experience can change the structure of the brain.
So that teen period of life it’s an exciting one for kids and they’re developing in lots of different ways. So teen behavior is generally changing. So how do parents still remain in the picture or how do they still influence their kids because a normal part of teenage growth is that they’re looking to their peers more and their peers are becoming more influential in their lives. So what advice do you have for parents of teens?
Erin Hoolihan, PsyD:
In working with parents of teenagers it’s not uncommon for me to hear from parents that they feel like they don’t matter. And that can be really, really hard for parents to experience. And I just want to speak to that really quickly because this isn’t consistent with what I’ve experienced when working with teenagers. Like they care so much what their parents think, and it’s not consistent with the research either and what we see is that parent influence just is always high in kids’ lives. It’s high when they’re young, it’s high when they’re in adolescence, like you were speaking to Cindy, that peer influence does go up during this time, which can make it feel like parents matter less, but really, I want to emphasize they still quote, unquote “matter,” however we want to conceptualize that, and I say that for two reasons, one to offer a little bit of hope, but also to encourage parents to be open to how this parental influence or mattering may look different compared to when the child is younger.
Cindy Lopez:
You as a parent, you will continue to matter as your teen figures all this out, and as Dr. Hoolihan also said, like be that safe place for them to come back to and we’ve done several other podcast episodes around communicating with your teen too. So that might be a good follow up for listeners is to go back and listen to a couple of those episodes because that communication piece and listening to your teen is really important. If you do more listening than talking, especially at this stage, that’s helpful.
So maybe talk about how parents can still matter?
Erin Hoolihan, PsyD:
That’s a great question, and like I said I like to encourage parents to shift maybe their view on what that mattering may look like. So when your child was young, maybe you could just sign them up for a little league or choir or ballet, and they would just kind of go along because they were young and why not? And now as an adolescent maybe they don’t want to do those activities that they did when they were younger. They don’t want to just show up to the activities that you sign them up for. And I think this can be really hard for parents, especially if taking your child to little league was the time in the car together, throwing the baseball was your weekend activity, but this doesn’t mean the parents don’t matter. It just means that your teen wants to go into the world and try new things and develop different passions. So in thinking about how to shift this focus, I encourage parents to shift away from maybe what the teen is doing to more of how they’re doing it and what they can gain from the new passions and interests that they’re trying. And as a parent to emphasize those positive behaviors and those behaviors that are consistent with family values within the new interests that your teenager’s trying.
Cindy Lopez:
Can you give an example of that, like what would that look like?
Erin Hoolihan, PsyD:
I think the reality Is that most teens who played baseball in high school will not go on to play in the MLB, right or most teens who are interested in theater will never perform on Broadway, but there are so many important values and lessons that can be learned like courage or compassion or leadership or self-reliance, or whatever family values might be important to you all that I would encourage parents to think about, okay, they’re doing a new activity, but how can I emphasize this and what they’re doing? So maybe they’re not playing little league anymore, but maybe they’re really passionate about graphic design, or ceramics or a new art that they’ve gotten engaged in and maybe you can promote courage within your teenager by encouraging them to enter an art competition, right, put their art on display somewhere, teach them how it feels to put themselves out there and either be praised or rejected, and so maybe it’s not the little league that you used to love them doing, but there’s still a lot that can be gained from this new art passion they’re exploring during their teenage years.
Cindy Lopez:
This is such an interesting topic to me, as I said, I’m just fascinated by brain development and how that impacts growth and specifically our conversation today about what that looks like in teens.
I really like what you just said about parents not focusing on what their teens are doing so much as how they’re doing it. As we close, I’m wondering what are the most important things for parents to remember about their teens?
Erin Hoolihan, PsyD:
The adolescent brain is developing quite a lot during this time, and adults and parents are seeing those changes through behaviors and emotions that may look or feel different than they did when the child was young. And the reality is that change can be scary, but my hope is that there’s also been a positive note to what I’ve been sharing today, and that’s that parents still have a large role to play in the lives of their teenagers.
It’s really important to model good behavior to your teenagers and be that safe person who’s understanding and compassionate, offering that grace, like we talked about for your teenagers to come back to after they’ve gone into the world and done some of that trial and error and maybe need some support, problem solving new challenges that they’ve never faced before, and that they still need those safe parents to come back to even if they’re gaining more autonomy during this period.
Parents matter with their teens. They still have a good amount of influence, but the influence may just look a little bit different, and this is where I encourage parents to think about what are those values? What are those lessons that you want your youth to move into the world with, and to really think about how those can be incorporated into your teenager’s new interests and new identities and how you can continue to support them during this period of transition and this brain development that is such a part of adolescence.
Cindy Lopez:
Dr. Hoolihan, thank you so much for joining us today. To our listeners, just want to remind you that we have quite a few podcasts around teens, so check those out. Dr. Hoolihan is part of our clinical staff at CHC, and we provide evaluations and therapy through our clinical services at CHC, and you can reach out to find out more about that at careteam@chconline.org. We have for parents whose teens might be more impacted with anxiety, stress, depression, even suicidal ideation we have an IOP, an Intensive Outpatient Program that you might check out, and we also have some DBT skills groups. DBT is dialectical behavioral therapy, and those groups are really an opportunity for kids, teens specifically, to build some communication skills and some coping skills around the anxiety and depression, dealing with that. So there’s all kinds of resources for you here at CHC, and we hope that if you need those, please reach out. You can find out more at chconline.org. Also to our listeners thank you for being with us, and we hope you’ll listen in again next week.
Erin Hoolihan, PsyD:
Thank you so much again for having me. I’ve loved our time together.
Cindy Lopez:
Visit us online at podcast.chconline.org. Make sure to subscribe to Voices of Compassion so you never miss an episode and we’d love it if you’d leave us a rating and review. Have a question? Send us an email or a voice memo at podcasts@chconline.org. We’re here for you when you need us.
